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Subject: Help: I have Grove vid on DVR.
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Username: Katfan100
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12/14/2006 11:40 AM Alert 
Thanks again Big Shady, and good luck installing everything.

=^.^="The Kat Pack Rock's...Oh Yeah!!!!"=^.^= tm Kim

http://www.myspace.com/katfan100
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12/14/2006 2:58 PM Alert 
Posted By differentlife on 12/11/2006 10:28 PM
I guess you'll have to use the other drivers then, the Naylia ones I posted earlier:
http://www.htpcnews.com/forums/index.php?act=Attach&type=post&id=1346

Here are some instructions on using them:

Part 1: Unzip the firewire.zip file

Extract (unzip) the contents to a folder, like c:\temp\naylia

Part 2: Install the drivers by connecting the cable box to your firewire card

From Naylia's post at http://htpcnews.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=10499

My additions are in [brackets]

Additions from other sources are in {braces}

---------

Ώ) Set a System Restore point in Windows XP in case you want to back out of the installation later

   * Start > All Programs > Accessories > System Tools > System Restore > Create a restore point > Give a description, "Create"]

2) Turn off your cable box and the PC  [Personally, I don't think this step is necessary, but I suppose it doesn't hurt to do it.]

3) Connect the firewire from the cable box to the PC. {IMPORTANT: The DCT64xx has 2 6-pin firewire ports. When facing the back of the DCT64xx make sure you use the firewire port on the right hand side (left side if looking from the front). I had problems using the other firewire port and many others reported problems trying to use that one. (replayguide note)}

3) Turn on the cable box

4) Turn on the PC

5) When Windows XP boots it should auto-detect some new hardware. Click 'Cancel' for all of them.

6) Open Device Manager...it can be found in the Control Panel -> System -> Hardware Tab -> Device Manager

7) You should now have some 'Unknown' Devices. Double-click AV/C Tuner [Or is it "Tuner AV/C Device"?]. Choose the 'Driver' Tab. Then select 'Update Driver'.

[If you don't see "AV/C Tuner" here, then maybe you should stop here and post what you see.

Hardware Update Wizard window: "No, not this time"

"Install from a list or specific location (Advanced)"

"Don't search. I will choose the driver to install."

"Have Disk"

Browse to the location in Part 1 above, where you extracted the files, like c:\temp\naylia

Select meistb.inf, then OK

You should see a compatible piece of hardware in the list. If not, try unchecking "Show compatible hardware". Choose Manufacturer Motorola, model DCT-6416 (or DCT6412 if the 6416 isn't listed?)

If it appears, ignore the warning about "Windows Logo Testing", and click "Continue Anyway"

"Finish"

]

8) This should successfully install the drivers for your cable box.

9) Back in 'Device Manager' right click on the other 'Unknown' Devices that appeared and Disable them.

(End of Naylia quote)

 

At this point, in Device Manager you'll have AV/C Tuner under Imaging Devices [check] and 2 Unknown Devices. We'll deal with one of the unknown devices later, once we get the basics setup.



^That's not exactly what I have.  Hope this isn't a problem.

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i64/khm32584/Random/other/devicemanager-1.jpg?t=1166129800

Username: Bigshady
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12/14/2006 6:04 PM Alert 
I think I might be ready to do some cappin. Do I need all of these or do I just pic one?

mpeg2repair: http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=MPEG2Repair
DGMPGDec: http://neuron2.net/dgmpgdec/dgmpgdec149b5.zip
MPEG2schnitt: http://download.videohelp.com/download/Mpeg2Schnitt087.zip
TMPGEnc: http://download1.pegasys-inc.com/download_files/TMPGEnc-2.524.63.181-Free.zip

Username: differentlife
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12/14/2006 9:43 PM Alert 
Posted By Bigshady on 12/14/2006 6:04 PM
I think I might be ready to do some cappin. Do I need all of these or do I just pic one?

mpeg2repair: http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=MPEG2Repair
DGMPGDec: http://neuron2.net/dgmpgdec/dgmpgdec149b5.zip
MPEG2schnitt: http://download.videohelp.com/download/Mpeg2Schnitt087.zip
TMPGEnc: http://download1.pegasys-inc.com/download_files/TMPGEnc-2.524.63.181-Free.zip


For the capping, you only need CapDVHS (see previous post on Capturing using CapDVHS). Note you might need the Microsoft firewire patch in that post.

That will give a "raw" TS file, basically a form of MPEG2 but a form that needs converting.

Do you have any video software that you use? It's possible that your software may be able to open the TS file and let you resave it as another form, like AVI, WMV, MPG, .... I think many mainstream programs won't be able to.

If you don't have other software that can convert it, it's ok you can use the ones I listed.

The TS can be converted with
(A) DGMPGDec
(B) MPEG2Schnitt, and
(C) TMPGEnc.

(A) will convert the TS file to separate audio (AC3) and video-only (M2V).
(B) + (C) will adjust the audio+video and then put them together into an MPG file.

MPEG2repair is optional. It can check for and repair errors in the TS file.

So A+B+C are required, at least with the procedure I use. I'll put together a post on using DGMPGDec, MPEG2Schnitt, and TMPGEnc. I was going to do that last night but I was distracted.

In the meantime, A, B, and C can simply be downloaded and unzipped into their own folders, like:
   c:\program files\DGMPGDec
   c:\program files\MPEG2schnitt
   c:\program files\TMPGEnc
or anywhere you want to put them, so long as they're in their own folder
Username: differentlife
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12/14/2006 9:59 PM Alert 
oh by the way, it's ok that you see AV/C Panel under Unknown Devices. Later, you can install the drivers for it. Once it's installed properly, you'll be able to change the channel of your cable box from your PC.

When you do your test capture, you can just set it to 1 min. You can also press stop at anytime and the resulting TS file should still be playable. Media Player Classic and VLC Player can play TS files.

For TS files (like most video files with AC3 audio) the volume of the audio is on the soft side. So don't blow out your ears alternating between TS files and regular videos with louder audio in them!
Username: Bigshady
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12/15/2006 1:02 AM Alert 
Posted By differentlife on 12/11/2006 11:08 PM

[NOTE: If, on the Data Info tab you see no resolution displayed, then you are collecting nothing on your computer, even though the file will continue to grow. If you see this, try closing CapDVHS and unplugging the firewire cable from your computer. Wait a little, then plug back in. Try CapDVHS again. I had to do this once for HD even though SD was working ok.]

I may be having a problem here.  I didn't see any resolution displayed when I was recording (I tried a one minute clip).  I tried playing the file with MPC and it says "Cannot Render The File".  I did the unplug thing and tried again..nothing.

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12/15/2006 11:15 PM Alert 
Posted By Bigshady on 12/15/2006 1:02 AM
Posted By differentlife on 12/11/2006 11:08 PM

[NOTE: If, on the Data Info tab you see no resolution displayed, then you are collecting nothing on your computer, even though the file will continue to grow. If you see this, try closing CapDVHS and unplugging the firewire cable from your computer. Wait a little, then plug back in. Try CapDVHS again. I had to do this once for HD even though SD was working ok.]

I may be having a problem here.  I didn't see any resolution displayed when I was recording (I tried a one minute clip).  I tried playing the file with MPC and it says "Cannot Render The File".  I did the unplug thing and tried again..nothing.


That's the kind of error I get when the cable box is not sending out a signal, for example when the channel is copy protected. (That may or may not be the case here.)

A few questions before I get to suggestions to try:

* Did you have to install the Microsoft firewire patch?

* What does CapDVHS show under "Capture Device" at the top? Mine says "Motorola AV/C Tuner Device (Unknown Video #1)"

* What did you try to record? Below I put a list of channels that can and can't be recorded

* Did you try to look at the 5C protection status on your cable box for the channel you were recording? The part in blue in my post "Capturing using CapDVHS" has the instructions. It doesn't work on my DCT-6200, but the instructions are for the DCT-64xx series like you have

* Do you have a Firewire Connection listed under Network Connections, in your Control Panel?
I'm wondering if it's possible that a firewall is blocking the traffic coming over the Firewire.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Channels that can or can't be recorded
1. You can only capture channels that the box says you're allowed to. These are:
a. your regular broadcast channels such as your ABC, CBS, NBC, Fox affiliates, etc. These would usually be the low-lying numbers on your box.
b. the High Def versions of those broadcast channels. For my cable provider, they are put up in the 700s range. So the HD version of my regular channel 2 is at channel 702.
c. other basic cable type channels
d. The above channels CANNOT be captured when the 5C protection is turned on for an individual program on a channel that is normally capturable.

2. A question is, are people allowed to capture shows that are recorded on the DVR and played back?
I would assume you can capture any DVR-recorded show that is allowed in #1 above. Can anyone else verify this? In this case, you would simply play the program and capture it as though it was currently being broadcast.

3. You cannot capture digital cable channels, premium channels, and whatever other channels have 5C protection turned on.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Some tests to try
Not knowing what you tried, I'll suggest everything I can think of.

Test: just your ordinary broadcast channel
Change your box to a regular broadcast channel.
Try the CapDVHS capture.
Try other channels (Stop CapDVHS between each channel change). Can you get anything at all to cap? It's
BTW I noticed that sometimes when I hit "Stop" in CapDVHS, the cable box turns off so you'll need to check that your box stays on.

Test: High Def version of your ordinary broadcast channel (if you subscribe to High Def cable)
Repeat the test after tuning to High Def ABC, CBS, NBC, or Fox

Channel changing test:
In the example below, you have unzipped the Naylia drivers to c:\temp\naylia.

First, you need to do a one-time setup of your AV/C Panel Device that appears in your Device Manager. You showed that it was in Unknown Devices. We need to have it recognized, not unknown:

In Device Manager, right-click the AV/C Panel Device
"Update Driver" or if that's not in the list, then do Properties > Driver tab > Update driver
The Hardware Update Wizard appears
"No not this time" when Windows asks to connect to Windows Update
Next
"Install from a list or specific location (Advanced)"
Next
"Don't search. I will choose the driver to install."
Next
Press "Have disk" button
Browse
Go to the folder containing the drivers, like c:\temp\naylia\Drivers
OK
Do you see an entry for "Motorola AV/C Panel DCT-6412" or the DCT-6416? (Or something similar with "AV/C Panel" in the name)
   If not, uncheck "Show compatible hardware"
   then hopefully you can choose DCT-6412 or DCT-6416.
Next. Ignore any warning about unsigned drivers
If everything goes according to plan, you can now see a "Motorola AV/C Panel Device (DCT-6412 or DCT-6416)" device in the Device Manager, and it is under "Imaging Devices". You'll still have the other Unknown Device but that's ok. It's supposed to be there.

If you don't get the right "Panel Device" showing, then the following test may not work however, you can still try the test.

Adapted from the MCE readme:
Firewire Channel Change Testing
In the example below, you have unzipped the Naylia drivers to c:\temp\naylia:

Copy all the files and folders from c:\temp\naylia
to a permanent home, such as:
   c:\program files\Timmmoore Firewire STB
After doing that, you should have a channel.exe file inside the "Timmmoore Firewire STB" folder

Start Menu > "Run..."
In the "Open:" line, type:
     cmd
OK. A command prompt will appear
Type the following on the line:
     cd "c:\program files\Timmmoore Firewire STB"
Now run the channel program:
     channel -v
You should see something like:

Firewire STB channel changer V1.0.9, by timmmoore
Device 1 Channel 1 Timeout 0 Dec 0

1 "FireBus MPEG2TS Tuner Subunit Device"
'Motorola AV/C Tuner Device'
"@device:pnp:\\?\avc#motorola&dct-6200&typ_5&id_0#376ed3feff5c0e00#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c9223196}\global" 0

2 "Motorola AV/C Panel Device"
'Motorola AVC Panel Device'
 UniqueID '376ed3feff5c0e00'
 VendorID 'e5c'
 ModelID '620a'
 VendorText 'MOTOROLA'
 ModelText 'DCT-6200'
"@device:pnp:\\?\avc#motorola&dct-6200&typ_9&id_0#376ed3feff5c0e00#{65e8773d-8f56-11d0-a3b9-00a0c9223196}\global" 1

Look for "Motorola AV/C Panel Device". Take note of the number in front of it. In the example above, the number is 2.

Therefore, try typing this at the command line.
      channel -v 2 59

This will send a change channel command to channel 59 to device 2. Look at your cable box to see if it obeyed the command. If it worked, then your computer is able to talk to the "AV/C Panel device" part of your cable box. That would mean that your firewire cable and firewire card setup are ok and we can narrow down why yours isn't working.

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12/16/2006 1:22 AM Alert 
I was trying to record live from ESPNHD before.  I guess I should've tried a couple different things before I reported back to you.  I tried recording my recording of the Grove.  IT WORKED!!  I played it back with MPC and it played just fine.  I don't know how the quality compares to what we have already since I haven't watched any of those.  But hey, progress right?
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12/16/2006 2:03 AM Alert 
Posted By Bigshady on 12/16/2006 1:22 AM
I was trying to record live from ESPNHD before.  I guess I should've tried a couple different things before I reported back to you.  I tried recording my recording of the Grove.  IT WORKED!!  I played it back with MPC and it played just fine.  I don't know how the quality compares to what we have already since I haven't watched any of those.  But hey, progress right?


Progress indeed, Shady!  Congrats and the quality should be awesome coming over from a digtal box via firewire it should be close to the best you can get.
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12/16/2006 2:37 AM Alert 
YAY!!!!! woohoo, let's hear it for the Big guy!

oh wait I'm supposed to post the next steps on how to convert the TS file to something more usable...

Do you have any video editing software that you use? Pinnacle Studio? Premiere? Videostudio? Windows Movie Maker?

If you do, try opening the TS file with it and take note:
Can you hear the audio?
Is the audio and video in sync?
But don't be disappointed if you can't even open it.

I'm still testing a new piece of software that might shorten the trip from TS to MPG file. If it works, it will save time and simplify the procedure. And save temporary disk space to boot. I hope to post it Saturday afternoon.

In the meantime, congrats and take a much needed break!
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12/16/2006 2:56 AM Alert 
I have Windows Movie Maker, which I've never used before.  It wouldn't let me open the file, saying it was not a supported file type.
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12/16/2006 5:22 PM Alert 

Converting captured TS to MPG

Commercial programs

Programs you pay for are generally easier to use. So you might want to try the trial versions of two programs I’ve read about but I don't have a whole lot of experience with them:

Video Redo Plus:  http://www.videoredo.com/Download.htm
Video Redo Plus will take your TS file and convert it directly to MPG. You can cut out commercials, save individual parts of the video and do other editing. Best of all, you just have to work with 1 program. However, it’s a 15-day trial and expires. Also, it’s not very intuitive to use.

Womble MPEG2VCR: I’ve never tried this. http://www.womble.com/products/
Womble: I haven’t tried their program, but I hear positive things about it.

Mostly free programs

The other way to do things is to use free programs. It’s more tedious and it takes more time. But you end up having more control over how things are done. It’s a matter of personal preference.

I'll now put up a few posts on how to install and use these mostly free programs...

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12/16/2006 5:23 PM Alert 

Converting captured TS to MPG (continued)

Part 1: Installing the mostly free programs

A. DGMPGDec: http://neuron2.net/dgmpgdec/dgmpgdec149b5.zip
B. Delaycut: http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=delaycut
C. TMPGEnc (not free): http://download1.pegasys-inc.com/download_files/TMPGEnc-2.524.63.181-Free.zip
D. mpeg2repair: http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=MPEG2Repair

Summary:
Program A converts the TS to individual audio (AC3) and video files (M2V)
Programs B+C: puts the audio and video into one MPG file ("multiplexes" or "muxes" them)
Program D is optional. It can fix errors (rare) in captured files

Details on installing the programs
A. DGMPGDec

This is the main workhorse to convert the TS into 2 separate audio and video files. It is written by Donald Graft aka neuron2.

Download: http://neuron2.net/dgmpgdec/dgmpgdec149b5.zip
Unzip somewhere, like c:\program files\DGMPGDec\
If desired, make shortcuts to DGIndex.exe

After DGIndex, you have separate audio and video files. Before we put them back together, in other words before we "mux" the audio and video, we need to account for the fact that the audio is offset from the video. Basically, there's a delay between the start of the video picture and the audio sound.

B. Delaycut
This little piece of software will add the appropriate delay to the audio file so that the audio and video are in sync, once we put them back together.

Download: http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=delaycut
Unzip somewhere, like c:\program files\delaycut\
If desired, make a shortcut to delaycut.exe

C. TMPGEnc
Now that you have the separate AC3 and M2V files, you can mux them together with TMPGEnc. The drawback is that certain functions, including the feature we need, expire in the free version after 30 days. After that, you would have to either buy it or override its rather primitive protection, which involves two renamable registry keys located here:

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\CLSID\{1ABF72A3-8502-4EC4-A42A-BCE3755E0C70}
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Pegasys Inc.\TMPGEnc\2.5

However, I would never advocate overriding expiry protection. I'm just commenting on the lack of robustness for educational purposes for aspiring software authors. Seriously.

Download: http://download1.pegasys-inc.com/download_files/TMPGEnc-2.524.63.181-Free.zip
Unzip somewhere, like c:\program files\TMPGEnc\
If desired, make shortcut to TMPGEnc.exe

D. mpeg2repair (optional. mostly for troubleshooting, but not a bad preventative measure for preventing problems